Welcome to the Big Sexy Chat Podcast Starring Merf & Chrystal | BigSexyChatPod@gmail.com
Aug. 18, 2024

Poly Want A Throuple? Myths, Love, and All the Feels

Poly Want A Throuple? Myths, Love, and All the Feels
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Season 3

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What if the love you sought could be found in multiples? Join Merf and Asherlee, our phenomenal producer and editor, as she unravels the complexities of polyamory. Asherlee, who steps in for Chrystal in this episode, shares her personal journey into polyamory, distinguishing it from swinging and revealing the dynamics of her own relationships, including her unique satellite connections. From the importance of responsible relationship management to the necessity of open, honest communication, this discussion offers a wealth of practical insights for anyone curious about or involved in polyamorous relationships.

Have you ever wondered how different relationships can meet various emotional needs without creating hierarchies? In this episode, we explore the concept of emotional currency and how polyamorous relationships can complement rather than compete. We dive into the experiences of "thirds," tackling societal pressures and the feelings of exclusion they often face. With references to valuable resources like the book "Polysecure," we provide guidance on navigating personal insecurities and societal norms that challenge the desire for love and significance in non-monogamous relationships.

Navigating the world as a BBW in the poly community comes with its own set of challenges. Our conversation touches on the impact of fatphobia and fetishization on romantic interactions, and why it's crucial to seek balanced and equitable relationships. We also unpack the myths surrounding "unicorns" and the problematic nature of "unicorn hunting." This episode encourages listeners to share their experiences, ask questions, and engage with our community on social media. Whether you're polyamorous, poly-curious, or just interested in understanding more about non-monogamous lifestyles, this episode celebrates resilience and the pursuit of meaningful connections.

If you're interested in checking out Polysecure: Click here

To check out the glossary of Polyamory terminology: Click here

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BigSexyChat.com appreciates you and our community. We do this for you, so if you ever have any ideas about a subject we can discuss for you, email us at bigsexychatpod@gmail.com.

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Chrystal also sells sex toys via her website BlissConnection.com and you can use the code BSC20 for 20% off.

Big thanks to our Sponsor Liberator Bedroom Adventures. We ADORE the products from Liberator. And, to be clear, we all loved their products even before they became a sponsor!

Chapters

00:37 - Navigating Polyamory

15:28 - Navigating Needs in Polyamorous Relationships

26:30 - Exploring Real Love in Polyamory

33:37 - Polyamory

37:53 - Navigating Attraction and Connections in Polyamory

49:07 - Exploring Emotional Connections in Polyamory

53:27 - Exploring Polyamory and Non-Monogamy

57:19 - Community Engagement in Polyamory

Transcript
WEBVTT

00:00:04.288 --> 00:00:05.812
Hi, welcome to Big Sexy Chat.

00:00:05.812 --> 00:00:07.695
I'm Crystal, I'm Murph.

00:00:07.695 --> 00:00:13.147
We're just two rad fatties sitting around chewing the fat Twice a month.

00:00:13.147 --> 00:00:21.774
We'll be chatting about current events hot topics sex, sex toys, fat politics, fat community cannabis, cbd you name it.

00:00:21.774 --> 00:00:22.600
We're going to talk about it.

00:00:22.600 --> 00:00:25.489
We are very excited to have you a part of our community.

00:00:25.489 --> 00:00:26.312
Welcome and enjoy.

00:00:28.420 --> 00:00:31.048
Hey everybody, welcome back to Big Sexy Chat.

00:00:31.048 --> 00:00:34.981
I am Murph, and today things are a little different.

00:00:34.981 --> 00:00:41.463
Crystal is dealing with some medical stuff and she's okay, everything's good, but she's not here for the pod.

00:00:41.463 --> 00:00:49.304
She said please go record in my absence, and so I thought to myself who could I involve in this process?

00:00:49.304 --> 00:00:55.542
Instantly landed on our amazing producer, editor all things.

00:00:55.542 --> 00:00:57.366
Big Sexy Chat, ashley.

00:00:57.366 --> 00:00:59.332
How are you everybody?

00:01:00.799 --> 00:01:02.404
I'm glad to have you on today.

00:01:02.404 --> 00:01:04.909
I am so glad to be here.

00:01:04.909 --> 00:01:06.832
I'm excited about what we're talking about.

00:01:07.439 --> 00:01:11.668
Yes, so we are talking about all things polyamory.

00:01:11.668 --> 00:01:19.114
We have had our guest previously with Sydney, who came on and talked about her experiences with polyamory.

00:01:19.114 --> 00:01:28.126
There was a lot of interest in that discussion and topic, something that you've said pretty regularly to me and to everyone else I know Do you want to say it how?

00:01:28.126 --> 00:01:29.912
It's different for every person.

00:01:31.962 --> 00:01:34.730
There is no cookie cutter way to be polyamorous.

00:01:35.620 --> 00:01:36.722
That's it right there, folks.

00:01:36.722 --> 00:01:47.567
So we're talking about personal stories, we're asking questions, we're learning, and one of the great ways to do that is to have those personal anecdotes and the things that you have through lived experience.

00:01:47.567 --> 00:01:57.134
So Ashley is going to jump in and tell us a little bit about her current situation and then what led to her discovering polyamory.

00:01:57.480 --> 00:02:05.426
So currently my situation is that I'm married and I do not have another partner right now.

00:02:05.426 --> 00:02:06.745
That is like a committed partner.

00:02:06.745 --> 00:02:11.090
I do have satellite connections, which is for people who don't know what that is.

00:02:11.090 --> 00:02:21.856
A satellite connection is usually a connection that you're close with emotionally, that you care for that, you tend the connection as you can, but they're separated by distance like a satellite.

00:02:21.997 --> 00:02:27.223
I do have people all over the world that I'm close with and care for deeply.

00:02:27.223 --> 00:02:31.051
I do have some people that I'm getting more and more close with.

00:02:31.051 --> 00:02:31.432
So we'll see.

00:02:31.432 --> 00:02:34.186
There might be another relationship at some point.

00:02:34.186 --> 00:02:55.545
For now my focus has not been creating another relationship, because for people who are polyamorous and who are in, because for people who are polyamorous and who are in committed poly relationships, they know it takes a lot of energy, it takes a lot of time, it takes a lot of dedication, it takes a lot of everything and I don't have it yet.

00:02:55.747 --> 00:03:00.062
I don't have that space right now because I'm not a relationship collector.

00:03:00.062 --> 00:03:08.905
There are definitely polyamorous people who really want to expand that love, and so they collect all the relationships that feel good.

00:03:08.905 --> 00:03:19.882
I am not that way because for me, I don't feel like I can responsibly care for a bunch of relationships and I want to be responsible with people's hearts and my own.

00:03:19.882 --> 00:03:21.605
I haven't had any for a while.

00:03:21.605 --> 00:03:24.992
I have had many and a lot of experience with it.

00:03:24.992 --> 00:03:26.824
Do you have any specific questions?

00:03:27.668 --> 00:03:32.040
I have a lot of questions actually, so maybe even some rapid fire.

00:03:32.040 --> 00:03:39.212
Yeah, polyamory is different from swinging, but there are some similarities.

00:03:39.212 --> 00:03:41.343
Can you tell us what the similarities are?

00:03:42.006 --> 00:03:43.610
Similarities would be sexual.

00:03:43.610 --> 00:03:49.991
I mean, swinging is pretty specifically just sexual, whether it's kink, whether it's whatever.

00:03:49.991 --> 00:03:59.545
It's you and your partner or partners, and other people and their partner or partners, or even just one person, but it's really like incorporating all these people and it's very sexual.

00:03:59.545 --> 00:04:02.520
It's great you do you Hell, yeah, get you some.

00:04:02.520 --> 00:04:07.828
While that can be an element for people who are polyamorous, it is different.

00:04:07.828 --> 00:04:11.453
Polyamory, like the root of it, is many loves.

00:04:11.453 --> 00:04:15.644
It's about having love of commitment.

00:04:15.644 --> 00:04:22.262
When you're in a poly relationship and multiple poly relationships, you're really committed to these people.

00:04:22.262 --> 00:04:26.588
They're real relationships, just like any other relationship.

00:04:26.588 --> 00:04:30.394
So it's the difference between hey, we're going to go on dates.

00:04:30.394 --> 00:04:32.223
Hey, we're going to care for each other.

00:04:32.223 --> 00:04:43.586
When we're sick, we're going to take care of the other person, we're going to check on the other person, we're going to put emotional time and energy and exchange into this, versus like, let's get it on.

00:04:45.108 --> 00:04:46.050
Yeah, absolutely.

00:04:46.050 --> 00:04:58.773
Do you think that the culture looks at this in a way that there is that hierarchy of like okay, well, you have a primary relationship and then you're adding this person into that.

00:04:58.773 --> 00:05:07.011
How do you navigate that process of not leaving that person feeling like a secondary?

00:05:07.913 --> 00:05:10.244
So I will say this goes into the.

00:05:10.244 --> 00:05:25.541
There's not one cookie cutter way of being polyamorous, because this is something that really works differently for everybody and I think a lot of people, when they start polyamory and they're already married or in a relationship, they really tend to have that even when they don't intend to.

00:05:25.541 --> 00:05:39.932
There tends to be a priority placed on the nesting partner, which is kind of just what it's usually called the nesting partner relationship, and then the other relationships are like, as I have time, it's difficult to navigate at any stage.

00:05:39.932 --> 00:05:43.843
It's difficult whether it's the beginning, it's really difficult through NRE.

00:05:43.843 --> 00:05:51.807
So when there's that new relationship, energy between a polyamorous person and another partner, that can be difficult for the nesting partner.

00:05:51.807 --> 00:05:57.052
So there's there's like a lot of different challenges and time periods and moments where that can be challenging.

00:05:57.052 --> 00:06:01.632
And the best way to navigate it is the best way to do anything, which is communication.

00:06:01.632 --> 00:06:05.887
It's it's open, it's all about open, honesty, communication.

00:06:05.887 --> 00:06:09.586
You're constantly talking to your partners.

00:06:09.586 --> 00:06:13.564
You're constantly explaining to them how you're feeling, what's going on, what's happening.

00:06:13.564 --> 00:06:15.910
You're not leaving them guessing.

00:06:15.949 --> 00:06:35.249
When you're in a lot of poly groups, you see this kind of thing come up a lot and a lot of people who are polyamorous and are veteran polyamorous people will talk about how irresponsible it is to have relationships like that, how unethical it is to have relationships that are having this like power dynamic struggle and they'll just be like don't do it.

00:06:35.249 --> 00:06:36.649
Just don't do it for this person anymore.

00:06:36.649 --> 00:06:50.324
It takes effort, intentional communication, time and a commitment to really working through it.

00:06:50.324 --> 00:06:57.487
There's no one way to make somebody feel like a priority except for making sure they feel like a priority.

00:06:57.487 --> 00:07:10.507
Talk to them about what their needs are, how often it is reasonable to see each other on any given week Schedule time and make sure that the other person knows like I am intentionally scheduling time to so important.

00:07:10.507 --> 00:07:29.182
And I think that, like how we talk about communication is lubrication.

00:07:29.182 --> 00:07:31.487
Communication isn't just lubrication.

00:07:31.487 --> 00:07:41.793
I mean it is part of any successful relationship, whether it's one relationship or two or three or four.

00:07:42.399 --> 00:07:49.627
Communicating is really the only way that you can balance that and handle those situations.

00:07:49.627 --> 00:07:54.502
And it's going to take effort, a lot of it, and you are still running the risk.

00:07:54.502 --> 00:08:03.644
There's also a chance, no matter what, that you're going to run the risk of another person feeling like they are the back burner, like they are second best, and that is so unfortunate.

00:08:03.644 --> 00:08:08.346
Because of a really big part of things, I have felt like that.

00:08:08.346 --> 00:08:15.689
I have my husband, I have a nesting partner and I work really hard to make sure that any partner I have does not feel like a back burner person.

00:08:16.971 --> 00:08:19.440
But I cannot say the same for every other person.

00:08:19.440 --> 00:08:23.824
I dated somebody who had three other relationships and two little kids.

00:08:23.824 --> 00:08:25.386
Somebody who had three other relationships and two little kids.

00:08:25.386 --> 00:08:27.086
You know where's the time You've got to work.

00:08:27.086 --> 00:08:38.475
I mean, how are you supposed to make somebody feel like a real priority when you're like well, I could see you next month for a few hours, maybe we could do lunch?

00:08:38.475 --> 00:08:40.496
It's really difficult.

00:08:40.496 --> 00:09:01.451
Part of why I don't do the relationship collecting thing because if I can't make sure that the other person is not going to feel like a back burner, is not going to feel like they're not a priority, is not going to feel like, oh my gosh, I'm just something to fill her free time and I don't feel like it's responsible for me to get in a relationship with that person.

00:09:01.451 --> 00:09:03.527
But I'm not everybody.

00:09:03.989 --> 00:09:09.405
Do you see that there's elements when you're talking about partners that you've had?

00:09:09.405 --> 00:09:17.912
Are there elements of I just really have good sexual chemistry with this person and I like you but I don't need a relationship?

00:09:17.912 --> 00:09:28.006
Are there elements of that kind of fun sexy stuff, but not so much like I have to carve out time and make sure that the kids don't know all?

00:09:28.047 --> 00:09:30.436
of that, yeah, there definitely can be.

00:09:30.436 --> 00:09:32.601
But I think, like anything else, it's a choice.

00:09:32.601 --> 00:09:36.672
I have this thing where I think that love is both a feeling and a choice.

00:09:36.672 --> 00:09:42.265
I think that way about most things, right, like I have a crush on Ryan Reynolds but I'm not just going to go run up and hump his leg.

00:09:42.265 --> 00:09:46.642
Maybe I would, but I probably wouldn't.

00:09:46.701 --> 00:10:07.595
I've definitely had connections that were really strongly sexual and the times that I've explored that have actually been when I'm not in a relationship, when I wasn't married, when I didn't have anybody else as a married person, and as a married person who has two kids and two animals and work.

00:10:07.595 --> 00:10:10.909
I don't explore that very often anymore.

00:10:10.909 --> 00:10:11.783
There have been times.

00:10:11.783 --> 00:10:17.491
Definitely it's always been with the intention that it's going to be more than just sexual.

00:10:17.491 --> 00:10:20.269
But before I was married I was still polyamorous.

00:10:20.269 --> 00:10:28.053
I did absolutely have those like man I just want to bone that dude moments and did.

00:10:28.053 --> 00:10:45.326
But for me that always felt it didn't feel like I was really polyamorous and living into polyamorous relationships, because for me polyamory really is attached to relationship, not just a sexual experience.

00:10:45.326 --> 00:10:47.086
But again, there's lots of ways to do it.

00:10:47.086 --> 00:10:49.850
I think there are a lot of people who do solo poly.

00:10:49.850 --> 00:10:56.070
That's one of the things that a lot of people really recommend when you start off the polyamorous journey for yourself anyway.

00:10:56.070 --> 00:11:09.828
People like that probably have more of those instances because they're dating however many people they want to at any point, and that can be like you know, hey, we go to dinner, it's up and that's it.

00:11:09.828 --> 00:11:17.004
No strings attached, just fun, friends with benefits, and they may consider that a relationship or they may consider that part of my polycule, my poly world.

00:11:17.004 --> 00:11:19.009
So it's really very different for everybody.

00:11:19.090 --> 00:11:20.682
For me, I just don't have the time.

00:11:20.682 --> 00:11:23.791
It's exhausting to put that effort out there all the time.

00:11:23.791 --> 00:11:27.806
Honestly, I've got toys that do a better job than most of the guys would.

00:11:27.806 --> 00:11:34.203
Anyway, if all I need is to get it off, I'd rather use my toy.

00:11:34.203 --> 00:11:36.288
At least it's guaranteed For me.

00:11:36.288 --> 00:11:42.187
Connections, at least in the last 10 years, have really been focused on emotional investment.

00:11:42.187 --> 00:11:43.730
I can get off anywhere.

00:11:43.730 --> 00:11:46.341
If I have a strong sexual attraction to somebody, I anywhere.

00:11:46.341 --> 00:11:49.875
If I have a strong sexual attraction to somebody, I tend to want to have a relationship with them also.

00:11:50.919 --> 00:11:57.086
Yeah, that's interesting because I have so many mixed emotions about poly and non-monogamy.

00:11:57.086 --> 00:11:58.489
I have no judgment.

00:11:58.489 --> 00:12:13.131
I've been with my partner for 24 years and I think there's no way I would have the same emotional connection with someone that enters that situationship, because I've had 24 years with this other person.

00:12:13.131 --> 00:12:19.985
You know like I would always kind of feel like, no matter what, you're going to end up being the back burner and I don't want somebody to feel like that.

00:12:19.985 --> 00:12:27.667
I want to be attracted to someone and I want to have that connection with someone, to have a sexual relationship, because that's the kind of person I am.

00:12:27.667 --> 00:12:33.515
I don't like to have just rando sex, which no judgment, just talking about my personal self.

00:12:44.320 --> 00:12:45.264
When you said, you know, this is my dinner buddy.

00:12:45.264 --> 00:12:47.195
Like we have dinner, we go have sex, I'm sitting there thinking, well, that sounds like a good deal.

00:12:47.195 --> 00:12:53.510
I know it's consistent, there's a relationship, but there's not this expectation of the emotional relationship component.

00:12:53.510 --> 00:13:02.205
So I'm just curious in your experience being in that world and with groups, do you see more often that people struggle with that hierarchy?

00:13:02.205 --> 00:13:11.169
I think, like okay, communication too, like most people can't even do that with a single partner let alone having the discussion of.

00:13:11.211 --> 00:13:13.023
now there's another person we're adding into this.

00:13:13.023 --> 00:13:14.307
Okay, and now communicate.

00:13:14.307 --> 00:13:21.980
So I just I'm curious, when you think of the overall culture of it, how often you see that I'd imagine it's pretty relevant.

00:13:22.360 --> 00:13:22.801
All the time.

00:13:22.801 --> 00:13:27.648
It's very relevant and I think that maybe it's some clarity around hierarchy.

00:13:27.648 --> 00:13:35.885
So when I'm hearing hierarchy, I tend to relate it to like this relationship is the top relationship.

00:13:35.885 --> 00:13:37.791
It is the one that I place the priority on.

00:13:37.791 --> 00:13:47.274
There's a difference between responsible priorities and that other gray area where it's like this is my dinner buddy.

00:13:47.399 --> 00:13:52.633
The thing about polyamory is that no relationship is going to be the same.

00:13:52.633 --> 00:13:55.506
Your relationship with James, right, you have this history.

00:13:55.506 --> 00:14:02.581
You have all this time that you've learned each other, that you've gotten comfortable with each other, that you have communicated and not communicated.

00:14:02.581 --> 00:14:07.594
You've worked through so much and there is no way for another relationship to compare.

00:14:07.594 --> 00:14:12.230
There's a difference between placing priority and comparing those relationships.

00:14:12.230 --> 00:14:21.083
You might have somebody that you want to go to dinner with, have intimacy with and spend some emotional investment with, but they're never going to be the same as James.

00:14:21.083 --> 00:14:24.371
They're never going to fulfill that same thing and they're not supposed to.

00:14:24.371 --> 00:14:30.222
The great thing about polyamory is that it shouldn't be about comparing this relationship to this relationship.

00:14:30.222 --> 00:14:36.529
It shouldn't be like can I have another relationship that's going to also fulfill me in the exact same ways that this relationship does?

00:14:36.529 --> 00:14:40.427
No, you're never going to, and it shouldn't really.

00:14:40.427 --> 00:14:44.905
If that's what you're looking for, then you're looking for a way out of the one relationship.

00:14:44.905 --> 00:14:54.043
If you're just looking for somebody to replace what this other person has done not that you are, I'm saying in general if that's what somebody is doing, they're really looking to replace that relationship.

00:14:55.566 --> 00:15:07.701
Most people in the poly world it's more about complementing and fulfilling needs than it is comparing relationships or placing priority or hierarchy on anything else.

00:15:07.701 --> 00:15:21.504
If you got in a relationship with somebody else right now and they were fun to hang out with, you, like spending time with them, you liked doing things with them, you liked being intimate with them, and you were like, hey, you know what I think I want to actually invest.

00:15:21.504 --> 00:15:28.215
Hey, you know what I think I want to actually invest more emotional currency with this person.

00:15:28.215 --> 00:15:36.126
I want this person to be a bigger part of my life, no matter what.

00:15:36.126 --> 00:15:36.951
They're never going to be what James is.

00:15:36.951 --> 00:15:38.057
They're never going to be that and they shouldn't be.

00:15:38.057 --> 00:15:39.384
If they are, then what's the point of James?

00:15:39.384 --> 00:15:48.522
Right, what you might need is somebody to go to dinner with and you might need somebody to experience new things with, but that doesn't make the other relationship less than Priority.

00:15:48.581 --> 00:15:50.008
Isn't about comparing.

00:15:50.008 --> 00:15:58.570
It's about making sure that somebody else realizes they are important to you and that they matter to you, and that you want to spend time with them.

00:15:58.570 --> 00:16:03.660
It's like when you have a friendship right, you want your friends to know that you care about them, you want them to know that you love them.

00:16:03.660 --> 00:16:04.881
You want them to know that you care about them.

00:16:04.881 --> 00:16:05.802
You want them to know that you love them.

00:16:05.802 --> 00:16:06.763
You want them to know that they're important.

00:16:06.763 --> 00:16:09.323
You can have as many friends right, but you may not spend time with all of those friends.

00:16:09.323 --> 00:16:12.886
It's really the same thing, yeah.

00:16:13.147 --> 00:16:44.764
I get that and I think where I've seen the most difficulty with this, especially when I'm working with patients, is that there's this element of being the third right and it's almost like, well, if you choose to be in this relationship with this individual and say maybe you're not even with the couple, just with one element of the nesting group, it almost seems like there's always a temporary element to it.

00:16:44.985 --> 00:17:07.343
And I think the patients that I've worked with in the past that's always been a struggle of just like if you're not going into it in the right headspace of like these people have primary relationships that I'm obviously not going to be a part of, but that doesn't negate the amazing connection or the emotional relationship you have with one or both individuals.

00:17:07.343 --> 00:17:47.042
But there's always this sense of like, but I know that I'm still trying to find whatever that also not as valuable, because you know like if shit goes down right, the couple's going to probably just like whoop, we're closing up shop and we're back to our normal selves we're closing up shop and we're back to our normal selves.

00:17:47.063 --> 00:17:49.528
When I think of a third, it's like okay, let's say it's a couple wanting to bring in another person.

00:17:49.528 --> 00:18:08.423
What I often see is that the person who is the third regularly feels kind of left out not completely left out, but as long as you go into that situations knowing this is not my primary, but I love these people and I want to have fun there's a different mindset.

00:18:08.423 --> 00:18:18.491
You have to be in for that to be successful, and I think what I often hear and see is that that isn't what's occurring.

00:18:18.491 --> 00:18:27.884
Right, people get into these sort of situations and then they're like well, I'm as equal, and it's like well, but has that been something that you've talked about?

00:18:27.884 --> 00:18:35.893
Is that something you're sharing, that you feel like you're in this and there's this sense of hurt that I see and hear people talk about.

00:18:35.893 --> 00:18:38.763
Do you hear that at all from other people?

00:18:39.705 --> 00:18:45.780
I think that the thing is the temporary aspect right, like how this person feels, like they're kind of temporary.

00:18:45.780 --> 00:18:49.950
Everything is temporary, every relationship is temporary.

00:18:49.950 --> 00:18:56.151
The only thing that determines whether it's not temporary is you and the other person.

00:18:56.151 --> 00:18:57.834
This life is temporary.

00:18:57.834 --> 00:19:00.487
I mean, we never know what tomorrow is going to hold.

00:19:00.487 --> 00:19:02.340
We have no idea what's going to happen tomorrow.

00:19:02.340 --> 00:19:05.605
So every single thing out there is temporary.

00:19:05.605 --> 00:19:18.781
And I think that if somebody goes into a relationship thinking, well, this is just temporary because I'm the third and I'm not as important, then that's what you're setting yourself up to do.

00:19:18.781 --> 00:19:25.548
But if you go into it and everyone is communicating and everyone is like sure, life is temporary.

00:19:25.548 --> 00:19:27.624
Every single relationship is temporary.

00:19:27.944 --> 00:19:33.448
One of my really good friends asked me and, mind you, I will say I love Steven, I choose Steven.

00:19:33.448 --> 00:19:36.116
That's one of our things is I choose you.

00:19:36.116 --> 00:19:38.767
Every single day I wake up and I choose you.

00:19:38.767 --> 00:19:42.642
He asked me one time do you think that you and Steven will be together forever?

00:19:42.642 --> 00:19:48.115
And I was like, if I choose to, because everything is choice, we get to choose that.

00:19:48.115 --> 00:19:50.461
We have legalities, right, we're legally married.

00:19:50.461 --> 00:19:55.811
Lots of people have been legally married and gotten legally separated.

00:19:55.811 --> 00:20:00.445
What makes it lasting is the choice to do so.

00:20:00.445 --> 00:20:10.490
If that's with a third person, then that's what the third person, no matter what it is a choice, it's you or whoever right, it's that person making a choice.

00:20:10.490 --> 00:20:11.560
So it's the hinge, right.

00:20:11.601 --> 00:20:25.611
When there's that kind of situation, we're not going to go into the throuple but like, if it's one person, their partner, this is their, connected me then they have a third person that one of them really likes, this one is connected to both.

00:20:25.611 --> 00:20:27.281
This is the hinge.

00:20:27.281 --> 00:20:34.663
This hinge's responsibility is to make sure that both people feel cared for, both people feel desired.

00:20:34.663 --> 00:20:37.371
Both people's needs are met, and those are going to be different needs.

00:20:37.371 --> 00:20:40.269
You're not going to treat them the same way because they're not the same people.

00:20:40.269 --> 00:20:48.326
They're going to have different needs, they're going to have different wants, they're going to have different communication styles, they're going to have different everything, as they should, because we're all different people.

00:20:48.326 --> 00:20:53.605
But it's this person's responsibility to make sure that this person doesn't feel left out.

00:20:54.266 --> 00:21:16.451
And if they are those people that are coming to you in therapy, if they're like I feel, like I am the third, I am the back burner, like I'm not really important anymore, you should be communicating to your person, to your partner I don't feel like I'm important, I don't feel like my needs are being met, because really, all of those things stem from the fact that our needs aren't being met.

00:21:16.451 --> 00:21:18.542
We need to be aware of what those needs are.

00:21:18.542 --> 00:21:22.811
Like you know, is the need, the real need, right?

00:21:22.811 --> 00:21:23.967
Is it that you have more intimacy?

00:21:23.967 --> 00:21:25.134
Is it that you have more communication time?

00:21:25.134 --> 00:21:25.517
Is it that you have more intimacy?

00:21:25.517 --> 00:21:26.700
Is it that you have more communication time?

00:21:26.700 --> 00:21:28.345
Is it that you have more connection time?

00:21:28.846 --> 00:21:36.421
What is the need that you're feeling is not being met, and communicating that to that person, and then that person, the hinge goes.

00:21:36.421 --> 00:21:46.536
I care about you, I love you, I want to spend time with you and I have this time set aside for this relationship.

00:21:46.536 --> 00:21:49.340
This is what I have available here.

00:21:49.340 --> 00:21:51.205
Is this something that's going to work for you?

00:21:51.205 --> 00:21:53.332
And then that person should be going?

00:21:53.332 --> 00:21:57.749
I really need more from you, or no, that's not going to work for me.

00:21:57.749 --> 00:22:03.006
If that's the case, that's the case, there's going to be other relationships.

00:22:03.163 --> 00:22:05.853
There's billions of people on this planet.

00:22:05.853 --> 00:22:12.285
The idea that we are only going to connect with one person forever it's not realistic.

00:22:12.285 --> 00:22:13.734
How many of us date?

00:22:13.734 --> 00:22:24.040
Very few people Meet one person when they're young, marry that person, stay with that person through their whole life, and if they do, it's because they chose to that person.

00:22:24.040 --> 00:22:26.930
Stay with that person through their whole life and if they do, it's because they chose to.

00:22:26.930 --> 00:22:27.170
That's it.

00:22:27.250 --> 00:22:28.173
So real quick background.

00:22:28.173 --> 00:22:29.457
I've always been polyamorous.

00:22:29.457 --> 00:22:34.130
I didn't always have words for it, I didn't always understand it, but I have always been polyamorous.

00:22:34.130 --> 00:22:38.847
When I was little, I had monogamous training.

00:22:38.847 --> 00:22:40.510
I grew up in a very religious household.

00:22:40.510 --> 00:22:45.921
There was only one person for you my mother, who has been married to more than one person.

00:22:45.921 --> 00:22:50.452
So you're saying there wasn't just one person for you.

00:22:50.452 --> 00:22:51.777
I'm confused.

00:22:51.777 --> 00:22:53.361
It's always been a thing for me.

00:22:53.361 --> 00:23:00.384
I have never understood how, on a planet where there are so many people, we're expected to find our one.

00:23:00.384 --> 00:23:01.769
You're going to find your one.

00:23:01.769 --> 00:23:12.243
You're going to find one that you really like and you really want to spend time're going to find one that you really like and you really want to spend time with and you really love and you really care about and you're really dedicated to, and then they want that with you.

00:23:12.243 --> 00:23:15.549
Fantastic, that's amazing.

00:23:15.549 --> 00:23:19.678
Congratulations, and our monogamous programming that we have had.

00:23:19.678 --> 00:23:22.190
It's mostly religion that did this to us.

00:23:22.190 --> 00:23:25.518
It tells us no, no, no, no, you can only have one, just the one.

00:23:25.518 --> 00:23:28.852
Okay, great, fantastic, yeah.

00:23:28.852 --> 00:23:30.997
But it never made sense to me, never once.

00:23:30.997 --> 00:23:31.657
And it still doesn't.

00:23:32.086 --> 00:23:33.067
I've got lots of needs.

00:23:33.067 --> 00:23:35.090
I am a big girl.

00:23:35.090 --> 00:23:40.420
I've got needs, lots, lots of them, and, to be fair, a lot of them are emotional.

00:23:40.420 --> 00:23:44.976
It's not even sexual needs Like Steven's fantastic, he's great, we have a great sex life.

00:23:44.976 --> 00:23:47.151
I'm not out there seeking like man.

00:23:47.151 --> 00:23:49.137
I need to get laid more.

00:23:49.137 --> 00:23:50.242
That is not my thing.

00:23:50.242 --> 00:23:51.204
I have emotional needs.

00:23:51.204 --> 00:23:52.086
I'm a needy bitch.

00:23:52.086 --> 00:23:56.574
I'm like, hey, I need someone to cry to.

00:23:57.234 --> 00:24:11.708
I need to vet Steven somewhere because I don't have anyone to cry to I have emotional needs and when you're in a relationship with people who care, that are loving and genuine, and you're all putting that love and care into each other, it just makes it easier.

00:24:11.708 --> 00:24:13.173
It makes it easier on my partner too.

00:24:13.173 --> 00:24:16.790
Steven has been like you are so much happier when you're in another relationship.

00:24:16.790 --> 00:24:18.174
It's pretty true.

00:24:18.174 --> 00:24:19.657
I've also had my heart broken.

00:24:20.359 --> 00:24:24.128
You go into it the same way you would any other relationship, no matter how many there are.

00:24:24.128 --> 00:24:27.176
Your heart could get broken at any single one of them.

00:24:27.176 --> 00:24:30.935
You could feel like not a priority at any single one of them, even if you're monogamous.

00:24:30.935 --> 00:24:35.232
You could feel like a third to somebody's work life.

00:24:35.232 --> 00:24:40.307
You could feel like a third to somebody's third to somebody's work life.

00:24:40.307 --> 00:24:41.309
You could feel like a third to somebody's friends.

00:24:41.309 --> 00:24:44.017
You could feel like a third for anything, because a person chooses what they make their priorities.

00:24:44.017 --> 00:24:53.214
If you're not a priority, if you're patient, if somebody comes in and they're not feeling like a priority, they're probably not, but they need to find out why and they need to communicate.

00:24:53.214 --> 00:24:55.967
I need to be a priority, so that's on them to communicate.

00:24:57.127 --> 00:25:00.050
Yeah, and I think we've already kind of gone over that.

00:25:00.050 --> 00:25:04.055
But that's probably the stickling part for all of this.

00:25:04.055 --> 00:25:18.452
It's very difficult to have a transparent, openly communicative relationship, and when you add other elements it makes it more difficult If you're not even aware of what your needs are, because you grew up in a religious household and you had these expectations.

00:25:18.452 --> 00:25:26.192
And I was listening to a podcast and one of the guys said the most difficult thing we have to do is unlearn the things we learned in childhood.

00:25:26.192 --> 00:25:38.971
And it's hard to do that when you have a culture that has created myths and stereotypes around the culture that you want to engage in or the lifestyle that you choose to engage in.

00:25:39.645 --> 00:25:40.950
It's fear, just like anything else.

00:25:40.950 --> 00:25:44.188
Right, it's people being afraid, it's people wanting control.

00:25:44.188 --> 00:25:51.853
How much of everything is because people want to control women, women's bodies, what we choose, what we do, who we love, what we care about.

00:25:51.853 --> 00:25:53.778
There's control.

00:25:53.778 --> 00:25:56.048
That's a massive thing.

00:25:56.048 --> 00:25:57.070
And fear.

00:25:57.070 --> 00:25:59.738
Nobody wants to be irrelevant, everybody wants to matter.

00:25:59.738 --> 00:26:03.441
They want to be cared about, they want to be loved, they want to be supported.

00:26:03.441 --> 00:26:06.470
If my partner loves somebody else, do I matter?

00:26:06.470 --> 00:26:07.873
Do I care?

00:26:07.873 --> 00:26:08.934
Am I important?

00:26:08.934 --> 00:26:13.093
Of course you are, of course you matter, of course you care, but it doesn't feel like that all the time.

00:26:13.534 --> 00:26:24.731
It's that less than it feeds all those core beliefs of you know I'm not worthy or I'm not unlovable because society has told me I have to fit into this box.

00:26:25.031 --> 00:26:46.007
And if somebody needs something outside of this box, then there's something deficient with me starts the poly journey for themselves, or if they're with somebody who is polyamorous, they should read Polysecure.

00:26:46.007 --> 00:26:48.109
Polysecure is like the book.

00:26:48.109 --> 00:26:52.298
It's a thing that helps you work through yourself, so like it helps show you what type of attachment style you have.

00:26:52.298 --> 00:26:57.492
It helps explain why you feel the jealousy that you feel, why you feel less than you know.

00:26:57.492 --> 00:27:00.038
And it's not even so much about specifically polyamory.

00:27:00.038 --> 00:27:12.393
It's really like this journey of self and discovering things about ourselves and healing those things about ourselves, which is a beautiful thing to do, and I think people should do it, whether they're in a polyamorous relationship or not.

00:27:12.393 --> 00:27:13.611
I think it's important to do that.

00:27:13.611 --> 00:27:17.336
You learn that I don't need to be just within myself.

00:27:17.336 --> 00:27:28.747
I will get so much more by giving of myself, communicating myself and listening to other people and like you'll just, you'll grow infinitely.

00:27:28.747 --> 00:27:35.031
So like love, like the greatest thing about polyamory, right, is that it's it is love multiplied exponentially.

00:27:35.031 --> 00:28:00.087
And when you feel love for yourself and when you feel like you matter and you're important and you've healed those things from childhood because most of us have childhood trauma you don't feel them as heavy anymore and that thing of like I'm not enough starts to fade away a little bit and you have more space for more love and more acceptance and more moments where you can be vulnerable with your partner or partners.

00:28:00.087 --> 00:28:14.229
You can have space to have conversation and communication, and vulnerability is scary, no matter how healed or not healed you are, you never know what someone's going to say or how they're going to take something.

00:28:14.229 --> 00:28:18.377
But taking that risk is also such a beautiful thing.

00:28:18.377 --> 00:28:22.094
The times in my life that I have gone, I give up.

00:28:22.094 --> 00:28:23.277
I give up.

00:28:23.277 --> 00:28:28.531
I am putting it all out there and for anyone who's ever seen my Facebook, y'all know that I do that.

00:28:28.531 --> 00:28:30.635
I'm like that's it.

00:28:30.635 --> 00:28:40.734
Here I am world Are the times that people have shown up, those people that come into your office and are like I feel less than I feel, like a third, I feel like I'm left out.

00:28:40.734 --> 00:28:42.188
For most poly people in general.

00:28:42.188 --> 00:28:52.211
Put yourself out there, take that risk and sometimes you're going to lay it on your face, but that is something to learn from, that's not something to be afraid of.

00:28:52.211 --> 00:28:56.131
When they're learning to ride the bike, they don't like fall off the bike and then, like I'm never touching that bike again.

00:28:56.131 --> 00:28:59.362
They might, they might or they might come back to it years later.

00:28:59.362 --> 00:29:00.445
Then I come back to it months later.

00:29:00.445 --> 00:29:01.528
Then I come back to it days later.

00:29:01.528 --> 00:29:03.114
They might get right back up on it.

00:29:03.114 --> 00:29:05.246
We're all different, but most of us.

00:29:05.685 --> 00:29:08.809
One of the great things about people I love people.

00:29:08.809 --> 00:29:11.712
Like, I don't always like people, but I love people.

00:29:11.712 --> 00:29:12.634
Humanity.

00:29:12.634 --> 00:29:15.156
We don't give up Like we just keep trying.

00:29:15.156 --> 00:29:16.878
We get beaten down.

00:29:16.878 --> 00:29:19.922
We've had life-changing, historic events happening.

00:29:19.922 --> 00:29:22.349
We're still getting up, we're still going to work.

00:29:22.349 --> 00:29:24.836
We're still caring about the people around us.

00:29:24.836 --> 00:29:26.268
We're still giving when we can.

00:29:26.268 --> 00:29:29.737
We're still loving each other, whether we're in relationships or not.

00:29:29.737 --> 00:29:34.156
It's the same thing with polyamory People complicate it, but it's about loving each other.

00:29:34.156 --> 00:29:35.537
And how do you love each other?

00:29:35.537 --> 00:29:37.207
How do you love yourself loving each other?

00:29:37.366 --> 00:29:38.328
And how do you love each other?

00:29:38.328 --> 00:29:38.970
How do you love yourself?

00:29:38.970 --> 00:29:50.729
Yeah, I'm part of a group on Facebook about consensual non-monogamy, you know, in the variety of ways in which that takes place.

00:29:50.729 --> 00:30:06.847
I asked what are some things that you wish people knew about this, because there's so many misconceptions and myths, stereotypes, and one of the things someone said was like I wish people realized it's not just threesomes, it's not orgies all the time, but it's real emotional work.

00:30:06.847 --> 00:30:36.833
I think there's this very glamorized perception of polyamory being an open relationship where someone's like oh, I'm just going out and finding whatever fits my needs, or we're bringing someone into this relationship and now it's this throuple thing, or we're adding more and more to the polycule and it kind of expands out, but it's always perceived with this lens of sex rather than this lens of relationship.

00:30:37.773 --> 00:30:41.286
Yeah, it is, and I think that's part of why I'm like man.

00:30:41.286 --> 00:30:49.153
There is so much of this that is about real love and real connection and real emotional exchange and those other things are great for some people.

00:30:49.153 --> 00:31:08.873
And there are plenty of people out there in the E&M and poly world who do those things, who are like, hey, I just want this to be fun, maybe that's what they need, and as long as that is communicated upfront and the other person knows exactly what they're getting into, do it, have fun, like have fun, get it.

00:31:08.873 --> 00:31:10.972
But eventually emotions are going to form.

00:31:10.972 --> 00:31:17.330
Eventually, if you're with somebody, most friends with benefits are like, oh, this is no strings attached.

00:31:17.330 --> 00:31:26.775
Eventually someone's gonna form feelings, maybe not both people, but someone's going to catch feels like, yeah, it's just going to happen, and like you have to be prepared.

00:31:26.775 --> 00:31:27.696
What to do at that point?

00:31:27.696 --> 00:31:28.886
What do you do then?

00:31:28.948 --> 00:31:32.675
You know Well, and I think that's probably like the.

00:31:32.675 --> 00:31:39.765
The experiences that I've seen with folks that ended poorly was that maybe they were upfront in the communication.

00:31:39.765 --> 00:31:56.426
But it's just like any other relationship where somebody's like I have this expectation that I'm not telling you about Right, and so it's out here in the ether and I just know that it's going to come to fruition Right, and so I'm just going to go along until the opportunity presents itself.

00:31:56.487 --> 00:32:24.946
You know and we see this over and over again in relationship therapy, where people will have these, I can change this person or I can change their mind about whatever the that was stated or this expectation, and I think that's where most people find their pitfalls I'm feeling unlovable or I didn't communicate the expectation that I had, and so now I'm in this feeling heartbreak, or I'm feeling like this didn't work, but those are the things that nobody really talks about when it comes to this, yep.

00:32:25.669 --> 00:32:28.016
Well, and it's like, whose responsibility is that at that point?

00:32:28.016 --> 00:32:34.317
Are you taking the responsibility of recognizing that you didn't communicate that expectation?

00:32:34.317 --> 00:32:40.700
Are you taking the responsibility of recognizing, like you know, this is part of my monogamous programming.

00:32:40.700 --> 00:32:46.836
Are you taking the responsibility to recognize, like, okay, maybe maybe I'm the problem, maybe, hi, it's me.

00:32:48.647 --> 00:32:56.528
So one of the things that I asked that group was you know, what are some things you wish people knew, and I kind of want to get your thoughts, your perception on that.

00:32:56.528 --> 00:33:03.596
So this person said I'm going to just read it off there Polly's not swinging.

00:33:03.596 --> 00:33:06.898
Not all polyfems are unicorns.

00:33:06.898 --> 00:33:09.001
Can you tell me what that means?

00:33:19.005 --> 00:33:19.125
person.

00:33:19.125 --> 00:33:22.794
It doesn't have to be a woman, but it's usually a woman or femme presenting person who is sought after as a third.

00:33:22.794 --> 00:33:34.277
There is this myth out there that if a woman or femme presenting person is polyamorous, she is open to joining a couple, and some are.

00:33:34.277 --> 00:33:48.776
There are people who are like man, I don't want to have to date super seriously, I don't like I want to matter and I want to be important in a relationship, but like I don't need that to be my everything you know and they really they really like just joining couples.

00:33:48.776 --> 00:33:50.250
How far do we want me to go with this?

00:33:50.250 --> 00:33:56.575
Because, like you and I both know, I've got my own thoughts about unicorns and unicorn hunting and how all of that really is.

00:33:57.057 --> 00:34:05.137
That feeling of being a third is the reason why so many people in the poly world are anti-unicorn hunting.

00:34:05.137 --> 00:34:11.188
For people who don't know, unicorn hunting is a couple that specifically goes out and looks for a unicorn to join them.

00:34:11.188 --> 00:34:16.148
A lot of times it's because there's something wrong in their relationship and they're looking to fix it with a third.

00:34:16.148 --> 00:34:16.929
That's not always.

00:34:16.929 --> 00:34:18.393
Sometimes it's they just want to have fun.

00:34:18.393 --> 00:34:25.958
Sometimes they really have a lot of extra love and they want to give it to one other person, but they want somebody who loves them both equally.

00:34:25.958 --> 00:34:33.951
And and that that same thing that we were talking about earlier where it's like can I have the same love for this person as I do for this person?

00:34:33.951 --> 00:34:35.914
It's never going to be the same.

00:34:35.914 --> 00:34:37.657
It makes an unfair dynamic.

00:34:37.657 --> 00:34:39.586
It does happen and it's so cool.

00:34:39.586 --> 00:34:40.690
I love when it happens.

00:34:40.690 --> 00:34:42.012
I love other people's happiness.

00:34:42.012 --> 00:34:44.427
I get so much joy and happiness.

00:34:44.427 --> 00:34:48.757
I get so much complicity within myself for other people when they are happy.

00:34:48.757 --> 00:34:50.726
I love seeing love play out.

00:34:50.726 --> 00:34:58.536
In however it plays out, whether it's a throuple, a giant polycule, whatever Bridgerton I was like, you know, get it.

00:34:58.536 --> 00:35:00.458
I love that.

00:35:01.438 --> 00:35:16.213
But it's rare and unicorns that is a big thing that people think Like, hey, man, as soon as we open this up, it's going to be so easy, we're going to find a girl who's going to be like, yeah, let's do it, because she's free and she just wants to have fun.

00:35:16.673 --> 00:35:26.391
No, most of us are actually along my lines where we're like, oh man, we want like a real relationship and like we want, you know, equal exchange of things and we want to really invest ourselves.

00:35:26.391 --> 00:35:30.855
And that's really hard to do in that kind of dynamic.

00:35:30.855 --> 00:35:40.952
Now, if you date separately, that's the thing most people will recommend Don't just date that person when you're together, date separately also, and don't just date that person when you're together, date separately also.

00:35:40.952 --> 00:35:43.340
So A dates B and C, b dates C and A, and then sometimes all three of them together.

00:35:43.340 --> 00:35:52.891
They have time separate and they have time together and all of that is prioritized for all three of them, and that is when you find that it works the best, and that is a beautiful thing.

00:35:52.891 --> 00:35:55.826
It is very rare, which is why it's unicorn.

00:35:56.666 --> 00:36:04.318
Unicorn hunting Got it I had somebody say that they hate being called unicorns and just call it a third yeah.

00:36:04.318 --> 00:36:09.005
So I had a couple of other things here.

00:36:09.005 --> 00:36:26.338
One that I felt was really interesting and I really want to get your perspective on is that there's this myth that if you're a BBW, so a big, beautiful woman, most people don't use that language other than sex-related activities, probably just because the acronym is really easy.

00:36:27.626 --> 00:36:30.554
So much easier to say BBW than it is to just say fat.

00:36:30.554 --> 00:36:34.434
First of all, the fat's actually easier to say.

00:36:35.085 --> 00:36:39.257
It's so much easier, but I think it's the sexualized version of fat.

00:36:39.985 --> 00:36:47.565
So it's like when you say BBW, you know that's somebody that you're describing in a sexual manner, that is fat, so yeah, anyway.

00:36:47.565 --> 00:37:02.550
So this person said BBWs are often targeted because of the weight, because they feel like there is this societal pressure or this expectation of like you're hard up for sex.

00:37:02.550 --> 00:37:05.641
So you know like you're the easy target.

00:37:05.641 --> 00:37:12.407
And she was mentioning from her experience in the poly world that she has to be very cautious because there's so much lying and deceit.

00:37:12.407 --> 00:37:14.951
That's sort of unicorn hunting.

00:37:14.951 --> 00:37:20.219
But like I'm going to go for what I think is the easy target in that process.

00:37:20.219 --> 00:37:21.990
Tell me about your experience with that.

00:37:23.545 --> 00:37:28.137
I think that that exact phenomenon exists inside and outside of polyamory.

00:37:28.137 --> 00:37:29.931
That happens within monogamy also.

00:37:29.931 --> 00:37:32.726
I think that is a really important thing to understand.

00:37:32.726 --> 00:37:35.050
That's not really poly-specific Right.

00:37:35.831 --> 00:37:38.539
it does happen all the time, no matter what.

00:37:38.539 --> 00:37:43.373
We're not the societal version of what is beautiful or desirable.

00:37:43.373 --> 00:37:45.398
Yes, it happens.

00:37:45.398 --> 00:37:46.460
It happens all over the place.

00:37:46.460 --> 00:37:47.262
It happens all the time.

00:37:47.262 --> 00:37:48.351
It has happened to me.

00:37:48.351 --> 00:37:52.882
I've definitely had guys not so much online.

00:37:52.882 --> 00:37:53.963
I meet a lot of guys online.

00:37:53.963 --> 00:37:57.931
That's really like my primary way of meeting people, because who really wants to go out and meet a lot of our?

00:37:57.931 --> 00:38:05.181
But out in the real world I've definitely had guys be like hey, I like them big.

00:38:05.181 --> 00:38:11.400
Do you like me big when I want to sit down at three o'clock in the morning and have a nice long conversation about life liberty?

00:38:11.420 --> 00:38:12.432
and the pursuit of happiness.

00:38:12.432 --> 00:38:16.387
I mean, do you really like them big or do you just want something easy?

00:38:16.387 --> 00:38:20.719
Because I'm not easy and recently I'm on on Woo Plus.

00:38:20.719 --> 00:38:22.342
I was on Woo Plus.

00:38:22.342 --> 00:38:25.739
I got kicked off because I tried to warn other women about this fucking guy.

00:38:26.139 --> 00:38:28.914
But this dude what is Woo Plus?

00:38:28.914 --> 00:38:30.659
Because a lot of people aren't going to know what that is.

00:38:31.309 --> 00:38:36.007
So Woo Plus is a dating site specifically for people who are attracted to fat people.

00:38:36.007 --> 00:38:43.815
Even better, there is an obnoxious amount of 20 something year old kids on there with their abs busting out everywhere.

00:38:43.815 --> 00:38:47.463
I get so many messages like hey, mommy, you're beautiful.

00:38:48.612 --> 00:38:51.559
No, sir, no sir, pack up your wares and take them someplace else.

00:38:52.440 --> 00:38:57.280
If there was a time in my life when you could have been sucking on these titties as a baby, then we are not compatible.

00:38:57.280 --> 00:39:00.105
This guy gets on there and he messages me.

00:39:00.105 --> 00:39:02.474
This is the thing that happens because of being fat.

00:39:02.474 --> 00:39:06.132
This guy gets on there and he is very charming, very engaging, very well-spoken.

00:39:06.132 --> 00:39:07.554
He's pretty cute, you know.

00:39:07.554 --> 00:39:13.054
And he's immediately pressuring me to hang out immediately.

00:39:13.695 --> 00:39:19.351
Within an hour of talking to him, I'm like, hey, heads up, just for communication purposes.

00:39:19.351 --> 00:39:20.523
I wait until I'm comfortable with somebody before I meet in person.

00:39:20.523 --> 00:39:20.996
I'm like, hey, heads up, just for communication purposes.

00:39:20.996 --> 00:39:23.376
I wait until I'm comfortable with somebody before I meet in person.

00:39:23.376 --> 00:39:26.452
And he's like I can respect that, but up to a certain point.

00:39:26.452 --> 00:39:36.853
And I'm like, okay, so the next day we're having a normal conversation about who we are as human beings.

00:39:36.853 --> 00:39:40.922
And he's like I'm at my limit for talking unless I meet you.

00:39:40.922 --> 00:39:48.117
And I'm like well, I don't know anywhere near enough about you for me to feel comfortable meeting you.

00:39:48.117 --> 00:39:52.021
And he, I kid you not replied back with I don't understand.

00:39:52.021 --> 00:39:53.878
It's not like you're getting a ton of guys on here.

00:39:53.878 --> 00:40:02.773
And I'm like actually, sir, if you looked at my unibacks right now, I think it's got at least five times what you've got.

00:40:02.773 --> 00:40:05.163
I think I'm good, I don't need to have this conversation with you.

00:40:05.163 --> 00:40:14.313
And he got super territorial, ended the conversation, went to all my pictures and commented saying this fat girl's going to play you.

00:40:14.333 --> 00:40:20.650
She's not going to meet you and I took a screenshot of his thing and posted it and was like, hey, ladies, watch out.

00:40:20.650 --> 00:40:24.981
Like this dude is territorial and he is just looking to fuck a big girl, just watch out.

00:40:24.981 --> 00:40:27.335
And I got banned plus because of it.

00:40:27.335 --> 00:40:39.541
They were like you can't share other users information and I was like, okay, well, when this dude hurt somebody because he's like this is a lot that's gonna be on you, just to work clear.

00:40:39.541 --> 00:40:45.684
Yeah, it was a whole thing, but it was because he saw a big girl out there was like you don't feel like.

00:40:45.684 --> 00:40:48.110
I'm like, hey, I, I could get with that.

00:40:48.110 --> 00:40:52.760
That's easy, easy, easy target, yeah I'm not, he's living.

00:40:52.820 --> 00:40:58.773
That stereotype of the fat girl says no, and then it's like oh, fat bitch, I hear crystal talk about that I've heard everyone talk about that.

00:40:58.793 --> 00:41:00.074
That just the heard everyone talk about that.

00:41:00.074 --> 00:41:06.121
That is the first time that somebody's really done that to me and I've talked to a lot of people, I've had a lot of connections.

00:41:06.121 --> 00:41:10.885
The first time ever that I got the like this fat girl doesn't want to.

00:41:10.885 --> 00:41:17.998
You know, see you, no, no, she just doesn't want to have sex with you after less than 24 hours of knowing you Right of knowing you Right.

00:41:18.018 --> 00:41:18.559
You go from.

00:41:18.559 --> 00:41:29.918
Oh, I find you so attractive, I want to get to know, you Well fine Fuck you fat bitch.

00:41:29.938 --> 00:41:30.623
It's like okay.

00:41:30.623 --> 00:41:31.809
Well then, obviously none of that was true.

00:41:31.809 --> 00:41:35.114
Yeah, it happens inside and outside of polyamory, but I definitely think it's safe.

00:41:35.114 --> 00:41:43.875
The main thing within polyamory is it feels safe for people who are single to hit on people who are polyamorous because they're already with somebody else.

00:41:43.875 --> 00:41:46.202
There's very little risk involved for that person.

00:41:46.202 --> 00:41:49.079
If all they want to do is have sex, they can easily do that.

00:41:49.079 --> 00:41:50.632
Mentioned the BBW thing.

00:41:50.833 --> 00:42:09.172
Someone came up right behind and messaged I get that a lot too, and it's because I'm older and I was like, oh, like okay, so we're just picking a group of people and we're saying like fetish or the easier, yeah, fetishize, but also like these are potentially the easier targets in this scenario.

00:42:09.172 --> 00:42:14.543
And that was really like, oh yeah, I did not, I didn't even think about that.

00:42:15.369 --> 00:42:22.804
I'd be curious to see that same question in a non-poly group, because I really think that it does not matter to people.

00:42:22.889 --> 00:42:24.155
I think there's a safety involved.

00:42:24.516 --> 00:42:26.088
Yeah, but it's so pervasive.

00:42:26.088 --> 00:42:37.061
I think just certain people think that other people are easy targets and when they see another person as a target, like no matter what, there's going to be something right.

00:42:37.061 --> 00:42:44.152
Like oh, she's blonde, so she's dumb, so she's going to be easy to find, or she's fun, you know, or she's a redhead, so she's fiery, so she's going to be hot in bed.

00:42:44.152 --> 00:42:46.193
Like there's all these stupid fucking stereotypes.

00:42:46.193 --> 00:42:47.974
They mean nothing.

00:42:47.974 --> 00:42:49.333
They mean fucking nothing.

00:42:49.815 --> 00:43:01.619
Yeah, one thing I didn't ask you and I'm curious about is do you look for partners from all genders or the spectrum of life?

00:43:01.619 --> 00:43:03.460
What do you look for when you do that?

00:43:03.460 --> 00:43:10.101
I think of omnisexual, right, like I have to have some sort of personality connection, emotional connection.

00:43:10.101 --> 00:43:13.842
I think it's sapiosexual, that's like you have to have that emotional connection.

00:43:13.842 --> 00:43:15.143
What is that like for you?

00:43:15.143 --> 00:43:19.965
Are you looking for one specific type or are you open to a whole?

00:43:19.985 --> 00:43:20.425
spectrum.

00:43:20.425 --> 00:43:24.786
That's like the first question that anybody on any dating site asks what are you looking for?

00:43:24.786 --> 00:43:26.867
And that's kind of the same basis.

00:43:26.867 --> 00:43:28.509
So I'm not looking.

00:43:28.509 --> 00:43:38.692
I've never been like I am looking for X, y, z.

00:43:38.692 --> 00:43:42.458
Because I think that it's really important for people to recognize whether they have a hole that needs to be filled.

00:43:42.458 --> 00:43:47.956
I don't have a void that needs to be filled because I have a very fulfilling relationship.

00:43:47.956 --> 00:43:54.911
I might have extra needs, but I'm not like, hey, I'm specifically looking for somebody who is going to do this, this, this and this.

00:43:54.911 --> 00:43:56.735
I don't have boxes that need to be checked off.

00:43:56.735 --> 00:44:02.456
I exist out there and I see what's out there and I see what connections happen.

00:44:02.556 --> 00:44:03.838
I'm very connection driven.

00:44:03.838 --> 00:44:10.626
I don't consider myself pansexual at all, but I've also never really had a sexual or intimate relationship.

00:44:10.626 --> 00:44:13.793
I've never had an attraction to a lot of people.

00:44:13.793 --> 00:44:15.556
I am demisexual.

00:44:15.556 --> 00:44:22.032
I do need an emotional connection to really feel desire and really feel like I want somebody.

00:44:22.032 --> 00:44:27.556
So it takes a while for me to form that connection and I'm really upfront about that right away.

00:44:27.556 --> 00:44:32.960
I need an emotional connection and then I just let the connection happen and see where it goes.

00:44:32.960 --> 00:44:37.505
Sometimes it goes to really beautiful places and sometimes it doesn't, but I don't look for anything specific.

00:44:37.505 --> 00:44:51.467
If a trans man came in who happened to be trans or or whatever else and like they were emotionally like present and intelligent and like they we had a shared whatever, I'd be like yeah, if it's, I've.

00:44:51.467 --> 00:44:56.001
I've had been attracted to women before one specifically, but it's very rare.

00:44:56.001 --> 00:45:00.139
The most common thing for me is just like the basic ass.

00:45:00.139 --> 00:45:06.840
You know dude Like, but it has its own problems.

00:45:06.840 --> 00:45:25.992
There's so many chads, murph this type of lifestyle.

00:45:26.012 --> 00:45:42.050
But it's something where I have always wanted a female partner involved in my life, someone I can play with their hair and they play with my hair and boobies and very like stereotypical, like you know but it's something that I've always wanted to have involved in in our relationship.

00:45:42.050 --> 00:45:43.052
But I don't.

00:45:43.052 --> 00:45:58.398
I have to have that emotional connection and I have to have that personality fit, and so it just becomes so difficult that I'm just like, unless I'm paying for somebody to do this, like it's not going to happen, because I just can't seem to get to that space.

00:45:58.398 --> 00:46:07.588
But I think a lot of people they're not looking at it like you are, of like can I just make a connection and what feels right?

00:46:07.588 --> 00:46:17.505
It's more like I have this perception in my head of like it has to fit into whatever and in my head, as long as the person has boobies and was gentle and plays with hair.

00:46:17.585 --> 00:46:29.585
So I'm thinking I have these very specific narratives in my head of what I would want that to look like, but I would need all these other things with it too, you know, and so I think it's gotta be really hard.

00:46:29.585 --> 00:46:32.695
Well, I mean, obviously it's been really hard because I haven't found anything like that.

00:46:32.695 --> 00:46:37.135
You're talking about needing this connection, this emotional component.

00:46:37.135 --> 00:46:46.893
Absolutely I'd have to feel okay to be vulnerable with this person because sex is something very meaningful to me, or I have to have nothing and it's like transactional.

00:46:46.893 --> 00:46:54.735
So it's like this two ends of the spectrum, which feels, I think, for a lot of people, can just be where they kind of feel stuck.

00:46:54.735 --> 00:46:55.496
How do you get?

00:46:55.577 --> 00:46:55.978
out of that.

00:46:55.978 --> 00:47:00.677
How do you open yourself up and do you have any tips or tricks for that?

00:47:01.789 --> 00:47:03.775
Yeah, read, polly, secure and do the work.

00:47:03.775 --> 00:47:05.981
I would say that to anybody and everybody.

00:47:05.981 --> 00:47:16.257
I think that doing the work like we were talking about earlier is really the most important thing Understanding who we are, what we are, what we like, what we don't like, what we want, what we need, understanding our own needs is so fucking hard.

00:47:16.257 --> 00:47:24.460
It's so hard because we have what society tells us we need and then our actual needs are usually very, very different than that.

00:47:24.460 --> 00:47:48.389
And understanding what we can fulfill for ourselves is hugely important, right, and it's hugely empowering to understand, like, yeah, I would kind of like somebody to do all these things for me, but actually some of this I do for myself, and so I think that, beyond just doing the work, being open, I can't stress enough how important it is to be open to what is out there.

00:47:48.389 --> 00:48:02.364
When you have an expectation and you move, it's an unspoken expectation You're really looking to fill that expectation, or change somebody to fit that expectation, which doesn't ever really work, to fit that expectation, which doesn't ever really work.

00:48:02.364 --> 00:48:14.331
If you go into meeting people, right, if you got on a dating site and you weren't looking with James, you were looking just for yourself, you know, and like, maybe whoever you happen to meet along the way likes James, maybe she does it.

00:48:14.331 --> 00:48:25.846
But if you go out there and you're meeting people interacting and through those interactions and connections start forming that genuine connection, that can be just for you.

00:48:25.846 --> 00:48:28.699
It doesn't have to be for James, and that's the thing.

00:48:28.699 --> 00:48:34.362
I think that when somebody is in a couple and they're moving into polyamory, there's this idea that I need my partner to love this person.

00:48:34.530 --> 00:48:37.018
There's a lot of people that are in the poly world.

00:48:37.018 --> 00:48:38.757
They don't like each other's partners.

00:48:38.757 --> 00:48:40.655
They can and it's fantastic if they do.

00:48:40.655 --> 00:48:42.179
There's kitchen table polyamory.

00:48:42.179 --> 00:48:44.132
There's so many different ways to be polyamorous.

00:48:44.132 --> 00:48:45.980
What is kitchen table polyamory?

00:48:45.980 --> 00:48:54.030
So kitchen table polyamory is where, like a kitchen table, right like you, you eat together, right like a family comes together and eats at the kitchen table.

00:48:54.030 --> 00:48:56.775
It's the same with a kitchen table type of polyacule.

00:48:56.775 --> 00:49:00.443
Everybody kind of is comfortable being around each other.

00:49:00.443 --> 00:49:04.039
Everybody's like communicating openly between everybody.

00:49:04.039 --> 00:49:12.693
Like you might have group chats, you might have board games, game nights and everybody really comes together and is good and kosher together.

00:49:12.693 --> 00:49:14.538
That just doesn't work for everybody.

00:49:14.538 --> 00:49:18.916
There are definitely people who have to do solo poly or parallel poly.

00:49:19.097 --> 00:49:22.172
I also think like what am I fulfilling for them?

00:49:22.172 --> 00:49:23.795
Is that the same goal?

00:49:23.795 --> 00:49:27.972
How do you find somebody who's looking exactly for those types of things?

00:49:27.972 --> 00:49:36.117
Let's go get drinks and have some apps, then go home and play with each other's hair and make out and just hold each other.

00:49:36.117 --> 00:49:41.500
That sounds great, but I don't think there's a lot of people out there looking specifically for that.

00:49:42.391 --> 00:49:43.496
You would be very surprised.

00:49:43.496 --> 00:49:48.797
There are a lot of people out there who are looking for very specifically that Finding them is a little more challenging, right?

00:49:48.797 --> 00:49:49.177
That's the thing.

00:49:49.177 --> 00:49:53.980
When you go out and you're just exploring connections, you're not looking for something specific.

00:49:53.980 --> 00:49:55.023
Here's the fun, right?

00:49:55.023 --> 00:50:00.503
Like this is a stereotypical thing for men or children, where's the pickles?

00:50:00.503 --> 00:50:02.376
You know, like who was looking in the fridge?

00:50:02.376 --> 00:50:06.137
Like you're trying to find something very specifically and like you can't find it.

00:50:06.137 --> 00:50:07.119
Well, of course you can.

00:50:07.119 --> 00:50:13.079
You're very specifically looking for this thing, and how do you know that that person's going to fit into that at all?

00:50:13.079 --> 00:50:13.961
You don't know.

00:50:14.190 --> 00:50:19.398
The best way to find out is to get to know somebody, to get to know as many somebodies as you need.

00:50:19.398 --> 00:50:21.983
Sometimes they're going to work out and sometimes it's going to be great.

00:50:21.983 --> 00:50:32.942
Sometimes it's going to kind of suck, but there's so much growth for ourselves that can come from that, from just interacting with other people, listening to other people, talking to other people.

00:50:32.942 --> 00:50:34.853
You do that for a living, right?

00:50:34.853 --> 00:50:39.280
I don't want that in my personal life, but you kind of need it.

00:50:39.280 --> 00:50:40.563
I mean, that's the thing, though.

00:50:40.563 --> 00:50:41.875
You're really good at that.

00:50:41.875 --> 00:50:42.416
You're great.

00:50:42.530 --> 00:50:45.340
I mean, how much along the way have you learned about yourself?

00:50:46.190 --> 00:50:49.440
Exponentially learned about myself through other people's experiences.

00:50:49.440 --> 00:50:59.103
I think that's a lot of reasons why people get into mental health is to build upon that and gain information from other people's lived experiences and their discussion, which is dating.

00:50:59.250 --> 00:51:01.414
That's dating right, Just not without the perks.

00:51:02.710 --> 00:51:03.936
Except you get paid usually.

00:51:04.650 --> 00:51:05.896
I was going to say financial perks.

00:51:05.896 --> 00:51:30.626
The best way is just to get out there to discover enough about ourselves, to learn enough about ourselves, to be comfortable enough in ourselves that we are able to be vulnerable with other people and recognize that those people may not have the same expectations, they may not have the same desires, they may not have the same connection, they may not, but they also might.

00:51:30.626 --> 00:51:35.045
I had no idea how I was going to like, if I was going to like James or not, when I met him.

00:51:35.045 --> 00:51:40.960
I probably was going to right, but, like when we have, we went to fat con the second I saw him I was like, oh, this dude's rad, I love this guy.

00:51:40.960 --> 00:51:43.143
I had never met him, but it's the same thing.

00:51:47.670 --> 00:51:49.315
Different type of connection, but connections happen all the time.

00:51:49.315 --> 00:51:51.726
It's just being open to them, letting them develop, letting them form and see where they go.

00:51:51.726 --> 00:51:57.697
You might find that your best friend, you know, is like actually exactly what I'm going to need.

00:51:57.697 --> 00:52:00.202
There's no way to know.

00:52:00.202 --> 00:52:01.023
There's no way to know.

00:52:01.023 --> 00:52:05.005
A lot of the most beautiful relationships aren't because somebody was looking for them.

00:52:05.005 --> 00:52:13.023
That's because they were allowing them, and I think that that is the key to anything.

00:52:13.023 --> 00:52:16.880
It's a choice, and it's just being open enough to allow it.

00:52:19.132 --> 00:52:44.094
I think that's what I'm taking away from this discussion is that while there are all these myths and misconceptions about poly lifestyles and all the things that come with it, we really have to shift gears and realize that this is about emotional connection and relationship building and love, not the sex.

00:52:44.213 --> 00:52:54.007
The sex is second, or maybe even third or fourth, or not even at all, but changing the narrative is going to be a big aspect of this for a lot of people.

00:52:54.168 --> 00:53:02.936
I'm hoping this has been enlightening to folks interested in exploring the idea of a poly relationship or some alternative, non-monogamous lifestyle.

00:53:03.518 --> 00:53:15.021
I think there's a lot of people who have a lot of interest in it and feel like they have just kind of been shrouded in the religious, you know ingrained doctrine of this is what you have to do to get through life.

00:53:15.021 --> 00:53:29.284
And now there's enough people talking about it where it's like, oh, I can start to explore or think about it and it's really helpful to say, ok, you know, yes, you can do all of those things, but it is about doing your own work.

00:53:29.284 --> 00:54:00.568
It is about recognizing your own beliefs, customs, all the cultures, of all the things that come along with exploring another relationship, because it's not just sex, it has all these other components that are super important the book that you mentioned, which we'll put in the show notes, obviously, but I think another thing that we need to do is put in like a dictionary, or maybe not urban dictionary, but something that explains all these acronyms and words.

00:54:00.568 --> 00:54:05.246
Is put in like a dictionary, or maybe not urban dictionary, but something that explains all these acronyms and words, because it's like a different language that does exist.

00:54:05.490 --> 00:54:15.081
No, I don't know that it exists openly out there in the world, but there's a poly relationship group on Facebook and I think they might make their PDFs available.

00:54:15.081 --> 00:54:16.090
I'll have to check into it.

00:54:16.090 --> 00:54:18.275
It's a whole glossary of all the terms.

00:54:18.657 --> 00:54:22.244
I mean things that seasoned poly people are like oh I didn't know that exists.

00:54:22.244 --> 00:54:36.443
There's ambiamorous and yeah, something like that I can't ever like for some reason my brain just doesn't know all the way around this word but it's somebody who is comfortable both in a monogamous relationship and polyamorous relationships.

00:54:36.443 --> 00:54:39.438
So it's not somebody who's not specifically just one or the other.

00:54:39.438 --> 00:54:40.661
And I kind of fall into that.

00:54:40.661 --> 00:54:49.242
Like I can be finding monogamous, while I do consider myself polyamorous because I can love and connect with more than one person in a deep, meaningful way.

00:54:49.242 --> 00:54:54.972
Like I don't necessarily have to, you know, and I think that there's a lot of people who fall into these gray areas.

00:54:54.972 --> 00:55:04.940
But there's there's glossaries that do exist out there and if I can track one down or check in with the admin and see if I can grab it and give them credit for it and put it in our stuff, I totally will.

00:55:04.940 --> 00:55:08.380
There's a ton of talks and tons of terminology.

00:55:08.380 --> 00:55:09.715
There's so much to learn.

00:55:09.715 --> 00:55:17.032
It's learning a whole new way of relationshiping with ourselves and with each other and I think that that's.

00:55:17.572 --> 00:55:21.081
You know, monogamy is what we were handed at birth.

00:55:21.081 --> 00:55:21.952
That's what we were told.

00:55:21.952 --> 00:55:30.601
But imagine a life where you're not told that the only way to be with somebody and the only way to love is to only love one person forever.

00:55:30.601 --> 00:55:33.710
Love is this big, infinite thing.

00:55:33.710 --> 00:55:45.199
Why can it only belong to one other person when there are so many people who are deserving of love and who can be loved and who feel wonderful to love and who can love me back?

00:55:45.199 --> 00:55:47.824
I hate to limit that.

00:55:47.824 --> 00:56:09.702
The biggest thing with polyamory is that it is exponential love love for ourselves, love for other people and I hope that more people really can take that away from it is that love doesn't have to be so limited and so small, because it can be as big as you want it to be.

00:56:09.702 --> 00:56:10.931
Oh, that's beautiful.

00:56:11.715 --> 00:56:12.918
I think that needs to be a quote.

00:56:14.552 --> 00:56:14.913
We'll share it.

00:56:14.954 --> 00:56:15.496
We'll make it a thing.

00:56:15.496 --> 00:56:16.829
I love it.

00:56:16.829 --> 00:56:19.692
Well, thank you so much for this conversation.

00:56:19.692 --> 00:56:28.697
I really appreciate your perspective and just your transparency and your and your honesty and your personal experience.

00:56:28.697 --> 00:56:33.061
I think a lot of people will take elements from this and explore and learn.

00:56:33.061 --> 00:56:39.184
That's really all we ever really want out of out of this podcast is for people to explore and learn and connect.

00:56:39.184 --> 00:56:45.992
I think that you've definitely articulated all of those things in this interview and for giving me your time while Crystal was out.

00:56:46.934 --> 00:56:52.155
If people have questions, post in our comment section, send us emails, send us messages, ask questions.

00:56:52.155 --> 00:56:56.954
If you hear this and you're like, okay, but that's how I do it, I'll be like, yeah, man, rock on for you.

00:56:56.954 --> 00:56:57.637
How do you do it?

00:56:57.637 --> 00:57:01.052
You know like, whatever, that's fine, I don't own polyamory.

00:57:01.211 --> 00:57:04.860
No one person owns the entirety of knowledge about polyamory.

00:57:04.860 --> 00:57:06.744
Tell us your experiences.

00:57:06.744 --> 00:57:08.574
Tell us what you've done.

00:57:08.574 --> 00:57:10.579
Tell us how it works for you, how it didn't work for you.

00:57:10.579 --> 00:57:13.934
Tell us, you know, jump in our comments and be like am I the asshole?

00:57:13.934 --> 00:57:15.797
Whatever you need, we can be here.

00:57:15.797 --> 00:57:16.619
We can care for you.

00:57:16.619 --> 00:57:18.521
You, we can love you exponentially too.

00:57:18.521 --> 00:57:20.065
You know, tell us how you feel.

00:57:20.972 --> 00:57:30.469
And while you're doing that, please follow us on all the socials so you can connect with us and connect with other people who have like-minded thoughts and feelings and questions.

00:57:30.469 --> 00:57:34.175
And we're at big sexy chat on all the socials.

00:57:34.175 --> 00:57:41.005
Our email is big sexy chat at gmailcom and you can find us at bigsexychatcom.

00:57:41.005 --> 00:57:46.260
Like, share, subscribe, tell your friends, review us all the things.

00:57:46.260 --> 00:57:49.797
Because, we want to keep producing content like this.

00:57:49.797 --> 00:57:55.315
We talk about stuff that people don't always talk about, and community is the best way to do that.

00:57:55.577 --> 00:57:57.181
Alright, see you later, alligator.

00:57:57.750 --> 00:57:59.409
Well, after a while crocodile.

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